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Post by Moonfire on Sept 20, 2007 16:49:16 GMT -5
I'd also like that state that I am in fact a hippie, and saving the rainforest is a good thing... Though I usually seem to forget I'm the only hippie here...
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Post by Cain on Sept 20, 2007 16:57:06 GMT -5
My point is that people who are against wars like to say things like "the opposite of war is creation" to try and get us to think that absolutely no good can come from a war when this assessment is obviously incorrect.
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Post by bruinfamer on Sept 20, 2007 17:02:03 GMT -5
My point is that people who are against wars like to say things like "the opposite of war is creation" to try and get us to think that absolutely no good can come from a war when this assessment is obviously incorrect. Depends on why the war is being fought. Take a look at WWII for example. There was a reason for that war. Some fucked in the head person decides to uphold the largest massacre in the world and dominates most of Europe. That needed to be stopped and it was. The "war" in Iraq is not even close to a war. Its just a conflict. |
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Post by MikDaTv on Sept 20, 2007 17:03:35 GMT -5
My point is that people who are against wars like to say things like "the opposite of war is creation" to try and get us to think that absolutely no good can come from a war when this assessment is obviously incorrect. well, yes and no. War itself, i don't see any good coming from it. Especially the pissy ass wars we have these days. The aftermath and outcome of a war is not always destructive though. After WWII countries were formed, the UN got created (Even thought it has since fallen down the tubes.) Nuclear power, space race, all that good stuff wouldn't be if WWII hadn't happened. so while i agree that some pretty darn nifty things come from war, the wars themselves are never good. |
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Post by Cain on Sept 20, 2007 17:04:29 GMT -5
My point is that people who are against wars like to say things like "the opposite of war is creation" to try and get us to think that absolutely no good can come from a war when this assessment is obviously incorrect. Depends on why the war is being fought. Take a look at WWII for example. There was a reason for that war. Some fucked in the head person decides to uphold the largest massacre in the world and dominates most of Europe. That needed to be stopped and it was. The "war" in Iraq is not even close to a war. Its just a conflict. Oil. There's your reason for it, whether you agree with it or not, that is something we gain from that war. There are other things as well. The point is there's no war that is faught just for the sake of destruction. My point is that people who are against wars like to say things like "the opposite of war is creation" to try and get us to think that absolutely no good can come from a war when this assessment is obviously incorrect. well, yes and no. War itself, i don't see any good coming from it. Especially the pissy ass wars we have these days. The aftermath and outcome of a war is not always destructive though. After WWII countries were formed, the UN got created (Even thought it has since fallen down the tubes.) Nuclear power, space race, all that good stuff wouldn't be if WWII hadn't happened. so while i agree that some pretty darn nifty things come from war, the wars themselves are never good. Wars are necessary. Now while the toll of human lives is never good, you can't say that good things never come from war. And that is all I'm saying. |
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Post by bruinfamer on Sept 20, 2007 17:09:58 GMT -5
Well yeah, Oil we gain but that has that shown here in the United States? No. Gas Prices are still to high.
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Post by Moonfire on Sept 20, 2007 17:11:35 GMT -5
*Sigh* War is sadly a part of life. Humanity wouldn't be humanity without war. Our primal and most basic instinct is to fight. Its how we've climbed the ladder up to the top after all these years.
I'll never agree with war, but I do accept it...
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Post by Cain on Sept 20, 2007 17:12:38 GMT -5
Well yeah, Oil we gain but that has that shown here in the United States? No. Gas Prices are still to high. How does whether you as a civilian seeing it or not effect the fact that its a gain? Your getting into personal politics here, this isn't about that. The question would be is Iraq all about destruction for destruction's sake and nothing else? |
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Post by Si Quan on Sept 20, 2007 18:20:27 GMT -5
I'm gonna take a stab in the dark here and say the opposite of war is negotiation. Kinda.
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Post by bruinfamer on Sept 20, 2007 18:25:31 GMT -5
Well yeah, Oil we gain but that has that shown here in the United States? No. Gas Prices are still to high. How does whether you as a civilian seeing it or not effect the fact that its a gain? Your getting into personal politics here, this isn't about that. The question would be is Iraq all about destruction for destruction's sake and nothing else? May I quote President Bush?"Iraq has chemical and Biological weapons." Months later."We have determined that Iraq has no chemical of biological weapons." We were going over there BECAUSE of those suspected weapons. But now that our president has fucked up real bad, we can't leave. That'll show every single country that we are weak. Now that we can't leave without being pussies, we are using Oil as a reason to stay. |
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Post by Cain on Sept 20, 2007 18:34:41 GMT -5
How does whether you as a civilian seeing it or not effect the fact that its a gain? Your getting into personal politics here, this isn't about that. The question would be is Iraq all about destruction for destruction's sake and nothing else? May I quote President Bush?"Iraq has chemical and Biological weapons." Months later."We have determined that Iraq has no chemical of biological weapons." We were going over there BECAUSE of those suspected weapons. But now that our president has fucked up real bad, we can't leave. That'll show every single country that we are weak. Now that we can't leave without being pussies, we are using Oil as a reason to stay. One last time. NOT ABOUT PERSONAL POLITICS. |
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Post by bruinfamer on Sept 20, 2007 18:39:51 GMT -5
Well yeah, Oil we gain but that has that shown here in the United States? No. Gas Prices are still to high. How does whether you as a civilian seeing it or not effect the fact that its a gain? Your getting into personal politics here, this isn't about that. The question would be is Iraq all about destruction for destruction's sake and nothing else? From a point of view, it depends. Remember that prision? That POW Prison where the Iraqi soldiers were tormented and shit? THIS IS NOT POLITICAL. THIS IS DESTRUCTION TO HUMAN BEINGS. It could be about destruction sakes in some ways. If we are trying to REBUILD Iraq, then why do we keep dropping bombs on citys? |
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Post by MikDaTv on Sept 20, 2007 19:08:53 GMT -5
How does whether you as a civilian seeing it or not effect the fact that its a gain? Your getting into personal politics here, this isn't about that. The question would be is Iraq all about destruction for destruction's sake and nothing else? From a point of view, it depends. Remember that prision? That POW Prison where the Iraqi soldiers were tormented and shit? THIS IS NOT POLITICAL. THIS IS DESTRUCTION TO HUMAN BEINGS. It could be about destruction sakes in some ways. If we are trying to REBUILD Iraq, then why do we keep dropping bombs on citys? Because thats where the bad guys are. We drop bombs on the bad guys. The bad guys die. The US infantrymen gain a few more yards. It's how wars are fought, and have been fought for centuries. Nothing different or more awful about it now then a hundred years ago. the real problem is we're not dropping enough bombs. Iraq would be a much different city today if god damn politics didn't get in the way of the military and the government itself. and Hock, just as an FYI. Good old Saddamy had WMD's. We know this because he used them before on his own people. there's also strong evidence suggesting that many of these WMD's were moved out of Iraq before the war to neighboring countries in an effort to cause political upset back home (In which they succeeded.) Hell, Clinton knew he had WMD's, hence why Navy and Air Force pilots hit Iraqi hard targets all over iraq in the 90's. |
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Post by Zilfer Of Shadows... on Sept 20, 2007 21:21:55 GMT -5
lol wow..... this topic took off..... and for once i'm on the side of mik and cain! woot!
Though i have a point that comes from way later in the convo that mik said, about basing philosopy off a movie or vidoe game. How is philosophy made? Is it not based off stories? Are not movies and video games stories? Hell i happen to beleive Anger makes you more focused and stronger, but also it can make you skip steps in logical processes. >.> Buy anyways it was more of a questoin, "what make's philosophy?"
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Post by MikDaTv on Sept 21, 2007 9:00:59 GMT -5
lol wow..... this topic took off..... and for once i'm on the side of mik and cain! woot! Though i have a point that comes from way later in the convo that mik said, about basing philosopy off a movie or vidoe game. How is philosophy made? Is it not based off stories? Are not movies and video games stories? Hell i happen to beleive Anger makes you more focused and stronger, but also it can make you skip steps in logical processes. >.> Buy anyways it was more of a questoin, "what make's philosophy?" No, philosophy does not come from stories. Philosophy comes from old guys with long white beards who sit in big leather chairs all day long and do nothing but think deep thoughts about things science can't touch. and philosophy has nothing to do with it. That kid was literally basing his world view on some bit of gibberish a Star Wars nerd over at BioWare thought was nifty. thats stupid... on one of the highest levels of stupidity. i've seen people base their education off movies. There are people i know who STILL think that scarab beetles eat people because they saw it in the Mummy. But deciding that peace is a lie because a video game says so is the height of idiocy. |
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