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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 1:28:20 GMT -5
a poor fate for humaity and a poor fate for yourself as well. you are the strongest, but alone. no one to acknoledge your streangth... no one for you to rule over with your streangth.
ultimatly, even with all your streangth, you become useless and with no conflict to become strong, you weaken.
and chain analogy is flawed. because peoples diversity is our streangth. togeather we are the strongest because eachothers weakness in coverd by everyone elses streangth. so to make it more accurate, its more like a chain, doubled or trippled up, where the weakest link shares his burdon with the others.
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Post by philly on Jul 11, 2006 1:44:41 GMT -5
Alone? No, there will be others. Those who, like myself, seek power above all else. Those who are willing to submit to my power and become slaves to my will. An apprentice must have a master to teach him to be strong and a master must have an apprentice to keep him from weakening. It is this system that keeps the Sith strong, even when our enemies are not.
Among the Sith weakness is not something we tolerate, there is only one chain because we all are trying to achieve one thing. If someone is a detriment or a threat to our ultimate goal of absolute power, they are eliminated.
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 2:04:17 GMT -5
but you said the goal was streangth for yourself, not for the sith. which is it. because if its streangth for the sith then there must be a limit of power that one reaches where they are not weak anymore.
if its just for yourself, then one should just kill everyone weaker then them, leaving you alone, but the strongest.
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 9:56:28 GMT -5
Corruption is a point of view, not the darkside. A point of view, by definition, is something that changes depending upon an individuals perspective. The darkside is and always will be the pursuit of power by any means nessicary, no matter who you are it's the same. Corruption on the other hand is defined as "dishonest exploitation of power for personal gain." the key word being "dishonest". Who's to say what is and is not dishonest. To deprive yourself of what you really want, that's dishonesty toward yourself. well i think there is something to be said here. the jedi also attempt to become more powerfull, its why they formed an order, to share their knoledge with eachother and become stronger as a whole. Darksiders would share their knoledge with others, then kill them when they had learned all they could. thats the exploitation of your own power for personal gain. Now, point of view... i hate this argument. point of veiw is a ten year olds excucse to do bad things. point of view is an excuse not to accept responcibility for your actions thinking that the situation and the way one views the situation FORCED, one to act in a certain way. the truth is, there is always a choice, no one is ever forced to make one choice over the other and i find there are two kinds of people. those who tend to make choices that are best for them and those who tend to make choices that are best for everybody. So the way i define good and evil is... people who accept the responsibility of their choices are good. people who don't accept the responsibility, opting to complain that from their point of view they were doing good things are cowards and evil. |
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Post by Si Quan on Jul 11, 2006 14:43:21 GMT -5
There's still different points of view. Though I agree that it is used as an excuse, that doesn't mean there's only one reason for everything. Saying there's no differet points of view is like there's no opinions. People can reach the same thing with different reasons for doing so, just as people can get to different ends with the same opinon or point of view. People can truthfully have a different perspective on something, and not use point of view as and excuse.
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 14:44:35 GMT -5
oh, i'm not trying to say there are no points of view... sorry if it sounded like that.
i'm just saying that in the fields of right and wrong, they don't matter.
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Post by philly on Jul 11, 2006 15:50:42 GMT -5
The goal of a Sith is power by any means nessicary. That is all. Whether that means strengthening ourselves or the Sith as a whole or both, it all depends on the situation. But your own power is always what is most important. Every Sith knows that he is only as powerful as his master, and he cannot move past him until he is defeated. And every master knows he is only as strong as his apprentices will to challenge him.
As to the second point, I'm not saying that I don't take responsibility for my actions when I say "point of view". He was saying that the sith are "evil" and do things that are "dishonest". Well it is the view of the Sith that power is ours by right, to deny what is ours would be being dishonest with ourselves. I'd hate to quote a Jedi, but as Obi-Wan said, "You'll find that the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own points of view."
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 17:27:58 GMT -5
your taking obi-wans words out of context... he was refering to the state of another person, not on a choice. he believed that once a jedi fell to the dark side, they were no longer the same person. thats his point of view, but it did not reflect on any of his choices.
and the sith use the point of view that their power is their by right, in order to do evil things, like slaughter millions of people. then they go on and on about point of view trying to convice us that what they did was really ok and they shouldn't get any ill consiquences from it.
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Post by Zilfer Of Shadows... on Jul 11, 2006 19:48:27 GMT -5
ok time to defend the sith i believe lol.
Ok from what i'm going to put out there may not be totaly correct becuase i'm not a sith person who knows all of it but here goes.
Sith want power like cain said, by any means nessicary. For one's self, and the sith. To kill every one below them would be a test of power and would strenthen you. same with leaving them alive, for they would challenge you sooner or later for power. Sith are in constant struggle and there is no end at all. For a sith to destroy all his enemys is impossible making the sith's goal for ultimate power possible.
Further more when does a sith not take resposiblity for his actions? uhhh hello? A appertice kills his master for power and claims resposiblity for that action. if he didnt then some one else would take the oppertunity. A sith destroys a world. He takes resposilbity for that as well. he just doesnt say that some one else blew it up and tells the republic to go fight someone else. The sith will fight back against the what the republic thinks or feels is wrong. They will Fight back becuase they are resposible for making their dissition and they think what they did was right, therfore taking resposiblity. The sith are resonsible as any jedi. There are unresonsible sith and unresponsible jedi.
*lol i think i turned that into a grey jedi view lol.*
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 19:52:08 GMT -5
quick comment on the without light there is darkness and without darkness there is light.
without light there is darkness... correct
without darkness there is nothing, not light, not darkness, nothing.
light has a source, it needs energy to exist. so this isn't some posative and negative thing that needs to be ballanced like in a battery. its not a ying and yang thing. its not a number of sith need to be equal to the jumber of jedi thing. its a the sith need to die so the force can be happy kinda thing.
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Post by philly on Jul 11, 2006 20:40:54 GMT -5
right on. I disagree with none of that.
darkness is the natural state of things, light is the interuption.
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 20:44:02 GMT -5
but the force is not an electromagnetic force composed of partecles and waves at the same time. its a mystical energy that does what it wants, and it doesn't appreciate fool using it as a tool for their own ends.
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Post by philly on Jul 11, 2006 20:50:45 GMT -5
name calling won't win you this arguement. The force will appreciate what i tell it to appreciate because it obeys me, not the other way around.
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Post by MikDaTv on Jul 11, 2006 21:15:58 GMT -5
untill it goes an nocks up some slave on tatooine and the most powerfull Sith ever ends up falling down a huge shaft because his engineers practiced poor building planning and put a reactor shaft in the throne room.  |
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Post by philly on Jul 11, 2006 21:34:38 GMT -5
one mans fate doesnt dictate my own. Sidious was powerful, but he wasn't perfect. He failed to see his apprentices weakness and in the end that was his downfall.
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